Verlaine ? Il est caché parmi l'herbe, Verlaine —Stéphane Mallarmé
Long ago, I sat in a circle of fifteen girls as Madame __, her hair brittle with red-orange dye, put us through French conjugations. I hadn’t much patience for the grammar, but I loved the sound of French words, the epitome of which seemed, at the time, to be Paul Verlaine’s Chanson d’Automne:
Les sanglots longs
Des violons
De l'automne
Blessent mon coeur
D'une langueur
Monotone.
Tout suffocant
Et blême, quand
Sonne l'heure,
Je me souviens
Des jours anciens
Et je pleure;
Et je m'en vais
Au vent mauvais
Qui m'emporte
Deçà, delà,
Pareil à la
Feuille morte.
Every language has its own character. Surely a good poet will bring out the particular qualities of the language in which they write.
Perhaps the best way to handle translations would be to take a literal translation and read it at the same time as hearing the poem read in its original language.
After all that is how we do understand a foreign language - not by making direct translations, but by understanding how the meaning emerges in that language's characteristic way.
(Sorry I am so late in commenting; I've been finishing an article for which the deadline is NOW.)
Susan, I must most heartily thank you for proving my point. None of those translations quoted comes anywhere near the easy, light as air, lines of Verlaine. The subject is bitter-sweet, why did not one of the translators bring out the melancholy notes?
Best thing is, just learn the language if you're interested in the poet.
I learned French from Verlaine (and Faure and Debussy). His poems have been successfully set by other composers too. That's the closest "translation" that I think can be applied successfully to Verlaine!
Fascinating points. I reckon every book of translated poems should have the original on the opposite page - if only there were world enough and time for us to be conversant in all the languages of the poets we love. I get a sense of it when listening to musical settings with the translations to hand - do you know George Crumb's Lorca, for instance - but I do feel the want of a basic grounding in, say, Spanish.
Friko is right - you should learn the language of the poet if you want to read them, but even that is not fool-proof. Some poets make heavy use of native colloquialisms and patterns of speech. Still, it's the best way. I prefer books that place the translation on a page opposite the original, so that I can plod in my clumsy way through the French, German or what have you. But since English is the only language I am fluent in, I focus on poets writing in English. I know I'm the poorer for it.
On a side note - do you highly recommend spotify? I listen to grooveshark quite a bit. Are you familiar with it and think spotify is preferable?
I'm sure Sue will come back to you, Mark, if she's a regular user of Spotify, but I can vouch that it has a pretty extraordinary catalogue - I use it to hear pieces I need to hear immediately, and I've given up buying the mp3 downloads (Amazon is better for that).
As for poetry on Spotify, of that I'm not qualified to speak. I don't know Grooveshark but why not have access (free, of course) to both?
You have another winner! Listened to both renditions and admire the clearly pronounced words and phrases. It was fun to read the poem while listening to the singers. If I repeated the process often enough it might be possible to acquire a passable French accent!
Right from the photo at the beginning of the piece you had my attention. All I can say is, "Brilliant!"
I agree those original French words convey a poetic image impossible to re-create in translation. You took me back to my schooldays when I first heard their music. Thanks.♥
To all: Your perspectives on handling (or not handling!) poetry in translation are wonderful and greatly enhanced my little post.
To each in turn:
Jenny: Thank you for stopping by. How right you are that every language has its own character—and hence the problem in trying to translate. White’s description of English in that regard was one I was particularly pleased to find.
Suze: I think you make a great point, certainly for poems that succeed as poems in translation. One that comes to mind for me, ironically enough, is Wislawa Szymborska’s “The Joy of Writing,” which I discovered through Friko’s Poetry and Pictures blog. I haven’t a scrap of Polish by which to test it against the original, but I loved the English-language poem.
Friko: And the language I really would love to learn, therefore, is Chinese. (This, however, seems just a tad unlikely . . .)
Elaine: That’s a wonderful site, which I only discovered as I put together this post. Isn’t it interesting how many settings there are of Verlaine? I love the idea of learning French through musical settings of French poets.
David: Of course, I had to race right over to Spotify to listen to George Crumb's Lorca, which I didn’t know at all. (An example of what you noted about Spotify. It’s great to be able to follow a musical suggestion just like that. Now if only the text popped up while I listened . . .) I agree that all translated poetry should show the original side-by-side, and I would go one further: at least when I was reading translations of Chinese, I really longed to see both the characters and a literal translation of their meaning (to the extent such a thing can exist).
Mark: Since I have a remnant left of French, having the original on the facing page is definitely useful. Less useful if the original language is Greek (thinking of Anne Carson) or Chinese, though, as I noted earlier, there I’d love to have both the characters and a literal translation of their meaning.
cybersr: Among other things, I’m pleased you enjoyed the photograph. It was fun to try and set up a photograph that worked—and, as usual, I had to take many to get one that “passed.”
jinksy: Ah, schooldays French. Glad the memories for you were good ones—mine, too, although, as I’ve noted, my memory of what I learned back then is miniscule, and the grammar is entirely gone.
Gary: Oh, dear, oh dear, I do hope conjugating French verbs doesn’t invade your dreams!
11 comments:
Every language has its own character. Surely a good poet will bring out the particular qualities of the language in which they write.
Perhaps the best way to handle translations would be to take a literal translation and read it at the same time as hearing the poem read in its original language.
After all that is how we do understand a foreign language - not by making direct translations, but by understanding how the meaning emerges in that language's characteristic way.
I think a translation is arguably its own poem.
(Sorry I am so late in commenting; I've been finishing an article for which the deadline is NOW.)
Susan, I must most heartily thank you for proving my point. None of those translations quoted comes anywhere near the easy, light as air, lines of Verlaine.
The subject is bitter-sweet, why did not one of the translators bring out the melancholy notes?
Best thing is, just learn the language if you're interested in the poet.
I learned French from Verlaine (and Faure and Debussy). His poems have been successfully set by other composers too. That's the closest "translation" that I think can be applied successfully to Verlaine!
Here's a listing of 142 settings of his poems:
http://www.recmusic.org/lieder/v/verlaine/
Fascinating points. I reckon every book of translated poems should have the original on the opposite page - if only there were world enough and time for us to be conversant in all the languages of the poets we love. I get a sense of it when listening to musical settings with the translations to hand - do you know George Crumb's Lorca, for instance - but I do feel the want of a basic grounding in, say, Spanish.
Friko is right - you should learn the language of the poet if you want to read them, but even that is not fool-proof. Some poets make heavy use of native colloquialisms and patterns of speech. Still, it's the best way. I prefer books that place the translation on a page opposite the original, so that I can plod in my clumsy way through the French, German or what have you. But since English is the only language I am fluent in, I focus on poets writing in English. I know I'm the poorer for it.
On a side note - do you highly recommend spotify? I listen to grooveshark quite a bit. Are you familiar with it and think spotify is preferable?
I'm sure Sue will come back to you, Mark, if she's a regular user of Spotify, but I can vouch that it has a pretty extraordinary catalogue - I use it to hear pieces I need to hear immediately, and I've given up buying the mp3 downloads (Amazon is better for that).
As for poetry on Spotify, of that I'm not qualified to speak. I don't know Grooveshark but why not have access (free, of course) to both?
You have another winner! Listened to both renditions and admire the clearly pronounced words and phrases. It was fun to read the poem while listening to the singers. If I repeated the process often enough it might be possible to acquire a passable French accent!
Right from the photo at the beginning of the piece you had my attention. All I can say is, "Brilliant!"
I agree those original French words convey a poetic image impossible to re-create in translation. You took me back to my schooldays when I first heard their music. Thanks.♥
Oh my, perhaps a case of lost in translation.
And now I've got memories of French class and conjugating the verb être.
Mon dieu....
To all: Your perspectives on handling (or not handling!) poetry in translation are wonderful and greatly enhanced my little post.
To each in turn:
Jenny: Thank you for stopping by. How right you are that every language has its own character—and hence the problem in trying to translate. White’s description of English in that regard was one I was particularly pleased to find.
Suze: I think you make a great point, certainly for poems that succeed as poems in translation. One that comes to mind for me, ironically enough, is Wislawa Szymborska’s “The Joy of Writing,” which I discovered through Friko’s Poetry and Pictures blog. I haven’t a scrap of Polish by which to test it against the original, but I loved the English-language poem.
Friko: And the language I really would love to learn, therefore, is Chinese. (This, however, seems just a tad unlikely . . .)
Elaine: That’s a wonderful site, which I only discovered as I put together this post. Isn’t it interesting how many settings there are of Verlaine? I love the idea of learning French through musical settings of French poets.
David: Of course, I had to race right over to Spotify to listen to George Crumb's Lorca, which I didn’t know at all. (An example of what you noted about Spotify. It’s great to be able to follow a musical suggestion just like that. Now if only the text popped up while I listened . . .) I agree that all translated poetry should show the original side-by-side, and I would go one further: at least when I was reading translations of Chinese, I really longed to see both the characters and a literal translation of their meaning (to the extent such a thing can exist).
Mark: Since I have a remnant left of French, having the original on the facing page is definitely useful. Less useful if the original language is Greek (thinking of Anne Carson) or Chinese, though, as I noted earlier, there I’d love to have both the characters and a literal translation of their meaning.
cybersr: Among other things, I’m pleased you enjoyed the photograph. It was fun to try and set up a photograph that worked—and, as usual, I had to take many to get one that “passed.”
jinksy: Ah, schooldays French. Glad the memories for you were good ones—mine, too, although, as I’ve noted, my memory of what I learned back then is miniscule, and the grammar is entirely gone.
Gary: Oh, dear, oh dear, I do hope conjugating French verbs doesn’t invade your dreams!
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